IGT 09/26 - Braves at Mets - Five more...

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Re: IGT 09/26 - Braves at Mets - Five more...

Postby d'Kong76 » Tue Sep 26, 2017 9:09 pm

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Re: IGT 09/26 - Braves at Mets - Five more...

Postby Edgy MD » Tue Sep 26, 2017 9:10 pm

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Wow.

That seemed like Peterson quit on that, but good job, TT.
I'll be your patron saint of heartbreak.

Re: IGT 09/26 - Braves at Mets - Five more...

Postby Frayed Knot » Tue Sep 26, 2017 9:10 pm

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Didn't like the bunt there w/Rosario, and hated it after the count got to 2-0
Nice AB by Taijeron to win it though!!
Last edited by Frayed Knot on Tue Sep 26, 2017 9:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: IGT 09/26 - Braves at Mets - Five more...

Postby LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr » Tue Sep 26, 2017 9:11 pm

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Breaks the Tai.

Nice ending. Off tomorrow. May stop by for our first home closer in a couple.
"Classic rock NEVER takes the weekend off."

Re: IGT 09/26 - Braves at Mets - Five more...

Postby Edgy MD » Tue Sep 26, 2017 9:13 pm

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Great answers, Travis. I actually feel like I know less than I did before that interview.
I'll be your patron saint of heartbreak.

Re: IGT 09/26 - Braves at Mets - Five more...

Postby batmagadanleadoff » Tue Sep 26, 2017 9:23 pm

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LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr wrote:Breaks the Tai.

Nice ending....


I thought you were rooting for the draft pick? Ten years from now, there won't be more than two posters here who'll be able to tell you with 100% certainty, how many games the Mets won this dreadful season. On the other hand, many experts think that there are four or five amateurs who are superstuds and good enough to be drafted first overall in next year's amateur baseball draft.

Re: IGT 09/26 - Braves at Mets - Five more...

Postby LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr » Wed Sep 27, 2017 12:27 am

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Oh, I'm not crying over the losses, and I certainly wouldn't rend any giveaway tees over sliding to the fifth overall pick or so (we're currently hovering at six). But sometimes it's viscerally nice to get a moment of respite from them, especially one with a little joie de boule on it, and flecked with moments of promise/gumption from the kinder.
"Classic rock NEVER takes the weekend off."

Re: IGT 09/26 - Braves at Mets - Five more...

Postby Benjamin Grimm » Wed Sep 27, 2017 8:26 am

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Re: IGT 09/26 - Braves at Mets - Five more...

Postby Centerfield » Wed Sep 27, 2017 8:27 am

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Frayed Knot wrote:Didn't like the bunt there w/Rosario, and hated it after the count got to 2-0
Nice AB by Taijeron to win it though!!


I hated it too.

In fact, the only good that may have come from that is we learned that Amed Rosario is really not good at bunting.

Re: IGT 09/26 - Braves at Mets - Five more...

Postby Edgy MD » Wed Sep 27, 2017 8:34 am

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It didn't seem to be something he wasn't good at, so much as something that was completely alien to him. Like the Mets had asked him to try and punt one inside the 20, or slap on some fencing gear and execute a passata sotto.

Systemic neglect of fundies is a concern. The Mets should run an all-bunting mini-camp.
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Re: IGT 09/26 - Braves at Mets - Five more...

Postby Ceetar » Wed Sep 27, 2017 8:39 am

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Edgy MD wrote:It didn't seem to be something he wasn't good at, so much as something that was completely alien to him. Like the Mets had asked him to try and punt one inside the 20, or slap on some fencing gear and execute a passata sotto.

Systemic neglect of fundies is a concern. The Mets should run an all-bunting mini-camp.


as in one where they say "never do this" and teach them about run expectancies?
"Look, would it save you a lot of time if I just gave up and went mad now?"

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Re: IGT 09/26 - Braves at Mets - Five more...

Postby Edgy MD » Wed Sep 27, 2017 8:48 am

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No.
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Re: IGT 09/26 - Braves at Mets - Five more...

Postby Centerfield » Wed Sep 27, 2017 8:52 am

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Edgy MD wrote:It didn't seem to be something he wasn't good at, so much as something that was completely alien to him. Like the Mets had asked him to try and punt one inside the 20, or slap on some fencing gear and execute a passata sotto.

Systemic neglect of fundies is a concern. The Mets should run an all-bunting mini-camp.


I can totally get behind this. Especially since they play back every time he's up. A player with his footspeed (and unfortunately, his low OBP) needs to have the bunt hit in his bag of tricks.

I'm shocked, with the shifts and all, that every hitter, power hitter or not, isn't learning how to lay one down when it's given to you and walk to first.

Re: IGT 09/26 - Braves at Mets - Five more...

Postby Centerfield » Wed Sep 27, 2017 8:54 am

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Ceetar wrote:
Edgy MD wrote:It didn't seem to be something he wasn't good at, so much as something that was completely alien to him. Like the Mets had asked him to try and punt one inside the 20, or slap on some fencing gear and execute a passata sotto.

Systemic neglect of fundies is a concern. The Mets should run an all-bunting mini-camp.


as in one where they say "never do this" and teach them about run expectancies?


Bunting doesn't have to be a sacrifice. The bunt hit is a great weapon.

And there are situations where the sacrifice bunt is appropriate. First and second, no one out, one run game, is one of those situations.

Either way, there is no detriment to having good fundamentals.

Re: IGT 09/26 - Braves at Mets - Five more...

Postby Ceetar » Wed Sep 27, 2017 8:57 am

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good way to pull a hamstring.

It's 2017+ and home runs are leaving the yard at record paces. I hope Washington fills it's lineup with guys that can drop down bunt hits.
"Look, would it save you a lot of time if I just gave up and went mad now?"

-Ceetar, the Optimistic Mets Fan

Re: IGT 09/26 - Braves at Mets - Five more...

Postby Frayed Knot » Wed Sep 27, 2017 9:13 am

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Run expectancies is an overall average which suggests that, like playing roulette, you'll come out on the short end the more you play.
But that's not to say that you should never play and deciding to never bunt is almost as idiotic as was the knee-jerk reaction that you were always supposed to bunt every time the leadoff runner
got on regardless of the inning/out/score/lineup situation was at the time. And last night's game had nothing to do with run expectancies as all you were playing for there was one.
I just didn't like it because he didn't look like Rosario was any good at it, didn't like keeping it on with a favorable count, and didn't like the odds of Taijeron cashing in on it even if it was successful.
Happily things worked out.

And if you're going to eschew certain strategies because you're afraid of running an pulling hamstrings then it's time to get out of the game and take up chess.
Every great cause begins as a movement, becomes a business, and eventually degenerates into a racket.

Re: IGT 09/26 - Braves at Mets - Five more...

Postby Ceetar » Wed Sep 27, 2017 9:22 am

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There are so few situations where bunting is clear and away the best strategy that I'd much rather players focus on other more useful skills. Like pitchers actually working on hitting. I'd rather Rosario take whatever time he'd spend bunting focused on pitch recognition and being more selective.
"Look, would it save you a lot of time if I just gave up and went mad now?"

-Ceetar, the Optimistic Mets Fan

Re: IGT 09/26 - Braves at Mets - Five more...

Postby Frayed Knot » Wed Sep 27, 2017 9:28 am

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Like it's an either/or decision.
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Re: IGT 09/26 - Braves at Mets - Five more...

Postby Ceetar » Wed Sep 27, 2017 9:36 am

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Frayed Knot wrote:Like it's an either/or decision.


There are only so many hours in the day, so many things you can work on. Adding "bunting clinic" to the list is like..40th and I think there might be more value in having all the players an hour more rested than having spending an hour working on bunting.
"Look, would it save you a lot of time if I just gave up and went mad now?"

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Re: IGT 09/26 - Braves at Mets - Five more...

Postby Edgy MD » Wed Sep 27, 2017 9:37 am

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Ceetar wrote:It's 2017+ and home runs are leaving the yard at record paces.

Yes, I know what year it is. The Mets have hit more homers than at any time in their history, and yet are 20th in scoring. They need baserunners.

Ceetar wrote:I hope Washington fills it's lineup with guys that can drop down bunt hits.

It's not an either/or choice. It never has been.
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Re: IGT 09/26 - Braves at Mets - Five more...

Postby Centerfield » Wed Sep 27, 2017 9:39 am

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Edgy MD wrote:
Ceetar wrote:It's 2017+ and home runs are leaving the yard at record paces.

Yes, I know what year it is. The Mets have hit more homers than at any time in their history, and yet are 20th in scoring. They need baserunners.


This.

Re: IGT 09/26 - Braves at Mets - Five more...

Postby Edgy MD » Wed Sep 27, 2017 9:41 am

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John Dewan, writing in 2011, wrote:When a sacrifice situation was in effect last year (a bunt with men on base and less than two outs) there were 2,285 bunts put into play. 232 resulted in a hit for a .102 "batting average." On the other hand, there were 850 bunts put into play in a non-sacrifice situation last year, with 372 going for hits, making for a .438 batting average.

And that was before the proliferation of shifts.

I hope the Mets fill their lineup with guys who hit .438.
I'll be your patron saint of heartbreak.

Re: IGT 09/26 - Braves at Mets - Five more...

Postby Ceetar » Wed Sep 27, 2017 9:55 am

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Centerfield wrote:
Edgy MD wrote:
Ceetar wrote:It's 2017+ and home runs are leaving the yard at record paces.

Yes, I know what year it is. The Mets have hit more homers than at any time in their history, and yet are 20th in scoring. They need baserunners.


This.


That's because they're not _walking_. because they're putting TOO MANY balls in play.

You know what else they're 20th in? Out of zone contact %, ascending. They're 18th in BB% but 7th in .ISO. Lucas Duda has 30 HR and 49 Runs. No one drove him in all year. (well, 19)



I don't know where those bunt numbers come from .Fangraphs has the Bunt attempts at 750 in 2011, with a 23.4% success rate. That's down to 497 with a 25.8% in 2017. What's that? a .516 OPS? You'd only need 1 single or walk in 4 tries to do better than that.
"Look, would it save you a lot of time if I just gave up and went mad now?"

-Ceetar, the Optimistic Mets Fan

Re: IGT 09/26 - Braves at Mets - Five more...

Postby Edgy MD » Wed Sep 27, 2017 10:03 am

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Ceetar wrote:
Centerfield wrote:
Edgy MD wrote:
Ceetar wrote:It's 2017+ and home runs are leaving the yard at record paces.

Yes, I know what year it is. The Mets have hit more homers than at any time in their history, and yet are 20th in scoring. They need baserunners.


This.


That's because they're not _walking_.

Well, there are only so many hours in a day. As if one obviates the other.

I don't know where those bunt numbers come from

Here.

Fangraphs has the Bunt attempts at 750 in 2011, with a 23.4% success rate. That's down to 497 with a 25.8% in 2017. What's that? a .516 OPS? You'd only need 1 single or walk in 4 tries to do better than that.

Well, John Dewan takes the time to distinguish sacrifice bunts from bunting for a hit.
I'll be your patron saint of heartbreak.

Re: IGT 09/26 - Braves at Mets - Five more...

Postby batmagadanleadoff » Wed Sep 27, 2017 10:55 am

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LeiterWagnerFasterStrongr wrote:Oh, I'm not crying over the losses, and I certainly wouldn't rend any giveaway tees over sliding to the fifth overall pick or so (we're currently hovering at six). But sometimes it's viscerally nice to get a moment of respite from them, especially one with a little joie de boule on it, and flecked with moments of promise/gumption from the kinder.


Yeah but you won't remember any of those moments by next season. Another Darryl Strawberry in a Mets uniform, you'll remember for the rest of your life. So will your kids.

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